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An important message from System 7 Today founder Dan Palka
 
 Topic: Free Speech (Page 2 of 3)
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  Minimalist (Profile)
  128 MB
 
Posted: Wed Mar 12, 2008 9:57 pm
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Lichen Software wrote:

You do however have to watch that they don't "over bight". Smile


I see you take liberties with grammar and spelling as well. As do I, as do I.
  
  Lichen Software (Profile)
  128 MB
 
Posted: Thu Mar 13, 2008 5:19 am
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Minimalist wrote:

Lichen Software wrote:

You do however have to watch that they don't "over bight". Smile


I see you take liberties with grammar and spelling as well. As do I, as do I.


English is a cheeky tart. It will steal from anywhere, mate with any language and when it cannot steal or mate it will just plane make up words. That is what makes it one of hte most dynamic languages on earth. I see no reason not to embrace that tradition.

Hmmm ... there is a heritage moment in that
  
  momo (Profile)
  8 MB
 
Posted: Fri Mar 14, 2008 7:42 pm
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Minimalist wrote:

dpaanlka wrote:

In Germany you can't have Nazi flags or utter the words sieg heil. Imagine that.


In Germany they want to forget that the Nazi Party was even a part of their past. And who could blame them? In Poland, however, they keep the concentration camps open as a tourist attraction.


Be careful: Germany does not want to forget.
It is actually the contrary: nazi concentration camps are open in Germany too (take Dachau, near Munich, for instance), and many other monuments in Berlin have been built as a memory of the holocaust.
The point here is remembering how dreadful humanity can be; the Nazi party has done horrible things, but Germans are taught to live with their history, and to learn from these mistakes.
The point of forbidding the nazi flags or other nazi-related expressions is not to forget what they mean, but it is instead way to not condone the racist ideas they convey (since all these symbols are being re-used all over the world by racist/extreme right-wing organisations).

I am not German, although I live in Germany. I do not know where you are from, Minimalist, and I do not want to criticise your statements which were probably not meant to be offensive, but I believe that another version of the facts had to be exposed.
  
  Minimalist (Profile)
  128 MB
 
Posted: Sat Mar 15, 2008 5:30 am
Quote
  
momo wrote:



I am not German, although I live in Germany. I do not know where you are from, Minimalist, and I do not want to criticise your statements which were probably not meant to be offensive, but I believe that another version of the facts had to be exposed.


I am not American, although I live in Canada. I was under the impression that the allied forces destroyed what remained of the Nazi regime after the war. I recall watching a documentary where it was stated that the french attempted to destroy much of the Nazi built buildings, etcetera. I know that the German government sealed many of the old Nazi bunkers and such to prevent the public from gaining access to them because they would have been too costly to destroy. I believe that some of the old Nazi government buildings still exist and are used as government buildings even today. I believe one or more of these buildings still have the Nazi eagle over the entrance, albeit with the swastika removed.

I suppose I would know more of what is and isn't still surviving in Germany of the Third Reich, if I actually lived in Germany. But I don't. Besides, this thread wasn't really about the Nazis or Germany, it was about free speech.
  
  dpaanlka (Profile)
  1024 MB
 
Posted: Sat Mar 15, 2008 11:32 am
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In germany there are still quite a few Nazi-era buildings surviving, both those used in some capacity by the government, and those that aren't. Hitler was very keen on architecture, and personally involved himself with the design of almost every large scale construction project in the country.

I find much of it quite impressive myself, and am actually disappointed hat the allies and the German governments have tried so hard to destroy it all. Thankfully, they didn't, and I don't think that is an active goal of the government any longer. In fact, one prime example is Hitler's 1936 Olympic Stadium in Berlin, which has recently been re-constructed and it's Nazi "flair" carefully preserved, right down to lamps and fixtures, which is a complete reversal of previous practice:

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The problem is, if Germany (and the EU) want to truly embrace free speech, as the United States does, they should not "ban" anybody's symbols or beliefs, because besides failing to actually limit persons who believe that way, they also limit people who are interested in the stuff from a historical standpoint. In the United States, we do not have a widespread neo-Nazi problem - they are simply mocked and ridiculed when they appear in public.

I myself have several books, and a few collectable items, including a full size swastika flag used as the national flag from 1934 - 1945. If I were to move to Germany, I would have to get rid of those things, which is a shame.
  
  Minimalist (Profile)
  128 MB
 
Posted: Sat Mar 15, 2008 5:27 pm
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I, personally, was impressed with the pomp and pageantry of the Nazi regime. As were most foreign governments and officials of the pre-war, pre-holocaust era. Barring their policies on race and human rights, the Third Reich was quite impressive.

Unfortunately, given what we now know of the Third Reich, particularly in relation to their polices on race and human rights, and more so, their actions toward achieving those barbaric policy objectives, it is difficult to look beyond their evils and concede that there were some good points in their favour.
  
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